To be sure, there’s much to be aware of among the 2,074 pages of the Senate’s health bill. Employers and employees will want to take special note, however, of two changes from the House version.
1. Employees
- Senate version: Has revived the plan to levy an excise tax on employer-provided high-cost insurance plans. A 40% tax will kick in for any amount that exceeds premiums of $8,500 for individuals and $23,000 for families. Another source: The Medicare payroll tax rate would increase for individuals with annual incomes over $200,000 and couples over $250,000. A person without insurance would be required to pay a penalty, starting at $95 in 2014 and rising to $750 in 2016, up to a maximum of $2,250 for a family.
- House version: A 5.4% surtax on high-income people.
2. How employers will contribute
- Senate version: Employers wouldn’t be required to offer coverage to employees, but if you had 50 or more full-timers, you’d pay a penalty of $750 for each one if any of your workers receive federal subsidies to buy insurance through the exchange.
- House version: Would require most employers to provide insurance to workers or pay a tax equal to 8% of payroll.
The two bills contain some other differences on controversial topics:
Abortion
Senate version: Would allow people who receive insurance subsidies to choose a plan that covers elective abortions, but insurers must use premium money or co-payments contributed by consumers, and not subsidy money, to cover the cost of the abortions. Would also require that every state offer at least one insurance plan that covers abortion and one that doesn’t.
House version: Would bar low- and middle-income people who receive federal subsidies to buy insurance from choosing a plan that covers elective abortions.
Coverage for illegal immigrants
- Senate version: Would bar illegal immigrants from buying insurance from a national exchange, even if they could pay the full cost and didn’t receive subsidies.
- House version: Would allow illegal immigrants to buy coverage from a national insurance exchange, but they wouldn’t be eligible for federal subsidies.
Subsidies
- Senate version: Individuals and families making up to 400% of the federal poverty level — $88,200 for a family of four — would receive a subsidy.
- House version: Essentially the same as the Senate version, but the subsidies would be offered on a sliding scale.
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Tags: benefits, health, insurance
November 25th, 2009 at 5:52 pm
“A 40% tax will kick in for any amount that exceeds premiums of $8,500 for individuals and $23,000 for families. ” Are you kidding? our insurance just went up from $5400 per person to $7500 per person this year (small office, only three employees) and none of us are even 60 yrs old yet. Can you imagine the when we go up to the next age bracket? Maybe the insurance companies should pay the penalty if they bump it to over $8,500……My boss is just trying to do the right thing and take care of the three of us. We may have to go without if the Government bumps our insurance another 40%. Oh, yeah, can’t do that…
“A person without insurance would be required to pay a penalty, starting at $95 in 2014 and rising to $750 in 2016, up to a maximum of $2,250 for a family.” Do they really think a person without health insurance has the money to be essentially “TAXED” for not making enough money???? People don’t go without insurance because they want to.
November 25th, 2009 at 10:48 pm
I am still opposed to big government running our whole health care system. It continues to be a problem of satisfying the demands of the giant and its needs above that of the citizens. I am sure there is still a lot of debate coming, but would personally feel better if the problems were corrected bit by bit, by those in the trenches, not the giant feeders in Washington. I beleive it has been well established at this point, that costs well not go down as a result of government takeover. I thought that was the original intent (to make health care affordable) for all. Good quality health care by some of the worlds most renown health practitioners is here and available, we only need to make it affordable and accessable. What we are witnessing in Washington with these God awful giant, cumbersome, conveluted, thousands of pages, confusing, destorted so called health packages is exactly what I refer to as feeding the giant. Not much in those monstorsities serve the people but rather they serve the authors and that ever demanding giant. Give me more, give me more so I can continue to grow. The giant promises never to shrink, but to continue to get ever bigger and more demanding. I realize it sounds silly to here it all referenced in those terms, but simply stated IT IS TRUE. Just watch as it unfolds and try to understand just what makes any sense other than grooming and feeding the giant.
November 26th, 2009 at 2:13 am
I still am not sure if Medical Insurance Preminiums will be a deductable expense to businesses. I would like to have this cleared-up.
November 26th, 2009 at 10:21 am
The proposed excise tax on high-cost plans would discriminate against employees of small businesses, particularly older individuals. A high-cost plan is matter of fact for a small business, simply based on the rates charged by insurers when there are few employees (even worse for self-employed). There is no indication that rates will go down from any of the proposed plans, only that more people will have some sort of coverage, good or bad. The fact is, our business already pays an amount greater than or close to the maximum that would be allowed under the senate plan – and that is for a “less expensive” high-deductible plan. The net is that the after-tax cost of insurance will go up for many small business employees, primarily older ones who already pay the highest rates.
The fact is, until our senators and congressman are on the same health plans as thereconstituents,
November 26th, 2009 at 9:01 pm
Have you ever seen the following:
1. A Successful Government run program that stays within budget
2. Medicare, Medicade or CHIPS not be on the verge of going bankrupt
3. The Lawmakers opt to take the same plan that they would push on the common people
Ask yourself these questions:
1. How can this be deficit neutral if we are already deficit spending by 1 trillion plus this year?
2. When the taxes of 8 – 40% in certain cases are levied on business, how many employees will loose their jobs to cover the additional costs
3. Why neither bill rules out jail time if you OPT OUT!
BillH
November 27th, 2009 at 10:55 am
“A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have.” Thomas Jefferson, 3rd President of the United States
“The problem with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other peoples money.” Margaret Thather, Prime Minister of Great Britain
Two very smart people from differing generations and backgrounds whose message is as correcttoday as it was when they said it years ago.
November 27th, 2009 at 12:51 pm
Neither of the bills solve the problem of runaway healthcare costs. Instead each in its own way creates more beaucracy, more taxes and more loopholes. The fraud within Medicare and Medicaid is a national “sin” that fails to be solved specifically in either proposals. The ridiculous medical malpractice suits will continue to go unchecked as the legal community continues to take legal action against any provider that even looks cross-eyed at a patient.
Lawmakers have proven once again how utterly ignorant they are collectively. These bills have taken up space on nearly 4500 pages of paper and have solved nothing except to add more cost to every American citizen. There are many good ideas floating around and no one in Washington intends on looking at them.
It is plainly and simply “criminal” what is being done and not done in Washington.
November 27th, 2009 at 8:00 pm
Can’t we make health insurance like car insurance. It would start a bidding war for my business that means rates go down not up. Then your employer doesn’t pay the premium, she or he can give you a raise or amount to help cover the cost. Then at year end there is some kind of tax credit for having your own health insurance. If you can’t afford insurance you get a “government plan”
November 27th, 2009 at 8:03 pm
They are going to need a wake up call come next November, If we don’t take the time to study the canidates and get behind the comon sense canidate that will go in and do what is right – we will pay dearly. The jobs will leave this country as never before. This proposal will kill us globally and the rest of the world is rooting for Obama and the gang on capital hill so they can pick up the pieces. Get involved now, find out who’s up for election and put some money and time into comon sense business people. That’s one of the problems – you need experienced business people working in the legislature, not carear polititions. The speaker and Reid – have to go !!!!!
November 27th, 2009 at 11:22 pm
Wow–thank you all for your insights and common sense observations. This health care thing is not about serving the people, but as you have all pointed out, serving the insiders. This gigantic mound of paper and labryinth of insanity they call reform is beyond the scoop of understanding by politicians and citizens alike. It is purely mind boggling and no matter your political persuasion it should scare you. Not one of our infamous leaders can honestly say they know what is contained within those glorious stacks of health care proposals. They all lie and only know half truths, hearsay, and fabricated ideas that don’t really exsist. It is so overwhelming it should be considered illegal to submit such deliberate misdirection. I have heard the arguement over and over that the government can make it work just look how successful medacare is. We all know it is going broke, but if it is so successful why not use it as a model for the health care program. It would only require 1 or 2 pages as an adendum to medacare to include all citizens in this so called successful program. Problem solved for everyone. Scrap all that other junk. Fund medacare with that several trillion that it is going to take to run the 4 thousand page health care reform, not steal from it. It is not as dumb as it sounds. Think about it! Could it be worse than what is being presented?
November 29th, 2009 at 10:00 am
I read all the arguments above arguing against the proposed Senate and House versions of the Health Care bill. The fact remains that the costs of our health care system have been spinning out of control for some time and will eventually kill our economy, we have millions of Americans who are insurance or under insured because they or their employers cannot afford health care, the cost burden to businesses that provide health care has continued to escalate and is costing jobs and causing businesses to either drop employee coverage or shift more and more of the cost burden to their employees, and the quality of care, despite these out of control costs, ranks below that of many other developed nations. SOMETHING has to be done – and I have not heard one proposal from the right wing Conservatives that makes any kind of sense. It’s easy to shoot holes at the proposals – its much more difficult to come up with an alternative plan that addresses the problem – and this problem MUST eb addressed.
November 30th, 2009 at 9:07 am
I would like for the government representatives to take a look at the public health care system in Japan or Germany. Both these governments seem to have overcome citizen worries and produced a national health care system that is cost effective for all income brackets. Does anyone know if that ‘research’ has been done?
The current bill, all 2000 + pages of it will not help the common man in America. If most of the jobs come from small business’ WHY does this bill punish the employer and employee alike with penalties or higher taxes.
If more taxes are required, fine-I will pay higher tax (1/8 a percent on my wages after Federal, FICA and Medicare are calculated) to help pay for this ‘health care’.
No one should be deprived of health care—–even a WOMAN who needs/wants an abortion. Speaking of sexism-it seems to be alive and thriving in America. Why punish a WOMAN’s decision to have an abortion. The worlds population won’t suffer from abortions according to some. Are Women involved in writing this bill?
Or is it only MEN?
All Federal employees and representatives and retirees MUST PARTICIPATE in the new national health care program. JUST like everyone else. That would make the representatives evaluate the must includes and taxation issue VERY carefully.
Making medicare available to all citizens is not a bad idea either. I had not thought of that concept.
Keep talking-this debate can not be left to our elected officials and medical insurance companies.
November 30th, 2009 at 11:37 am
It doesn’t take over 2,000 pages to do anything good for the people. Part of the explanation for the length is that it took three pages to say the word: ‘Louisiana’. When the Democrats wanted to direct 300 million to get the Senator from Louisiana’s vote on the bill, they had to define it in a way that obscured the truth. It took three pages of text to say what could have been said in one word! Louisiana. Everything is about obscuring the truth. That’s why it is a 2,000 page bill…. if there was any truth and honesty to this legislation; it could be spelled out in understandable terms. I imagine the ‘operating instructions’ to administrate the program will be equally easy to understand. In other words, there will be language to support whatever crazy and misguided decision some bureaucrat makes about your health. The ‘common man’ and the small business owner doesn’t stand a chance here…
I imagine they have worked equally hard to obscure the actual cost. They certainly have misrepresented the ‘savings’ available by “cleaning up waste and fraud” in Medicare.
November 30th, 2009 at 12:40 pm
Governmment is in the business of creating a crisis to provide a solution that takes away personal freedom. More than half of those not covered by insurance don’t want to pay to have it. I like the Republican proposal to cap tort settlements, force insurance companies to not carve out for pre-existing conditions and open insurance competition across state lines. When government gets involved, we all pay (spelled Fannie Mac and Freddies Mac). I want to keep the insurance plan I have. Create the competition environment for others not covered to get insurance, if they want it, which will raise rates for everyone a little, but keep the goverment out of it. The lawyers are lining up already (they always get paid) to challenge the constitutionality of a mandate in these health plans to pay if you DON’T do something. And, if Obama was so concerned about Medicare, why hasn’t he done anything. It has been his for a year already. It is too convenient as a whipping boy.
November 30th, 2009 at 1:07 pm
Anyone stupid enough to vote for these idiotic “unpatriotic” Socialists should be happy now. You are handing our freedom, liberty, and culture away to these dimwits on a silver platter. When America
” the last beacon of hope” for spreading freedom and the free enterprise system where people are rewarded for achievment, becomes just another land mass in the “Global Community” (Barf!) we can all kiss our butts goodbye. We need to take a stand NOW! Stop these “Anti-Americans” NOW!
November 30th, 2009 at 4:55 pm
I have worked in healthcare for 20 years now, my degree is Healthcare Administration. I hold an executive level position in a healthcare organization. I have worked with Medicaid, Medicaid products and Medicare for almost 20 years. I can tell you it is a nightmare just to get paid and the reimbursements are HORRIBLE, all government funded programs! And we want more? Be careful what you wish for and read the facts! This is not the answer.
November 30th, 2009 at 9:28 pm
Serious polititions will be working to change tort reform, mal practice, mandates, and maybe overweight americans. these are the largest cost drivers in our healthcare system. If you had serious reform in these areas you could make healthcare affordable for all Americans. We wouldn’t be having this debate. I would encourage each of you to contact your Senators now by email, letter, fax and phone calls. Let them know they were elected to represent you and you expect them to address these concerns, and if they fail to- you’ll spend money and time to see that they are defeated the next time they run for office. You can make a difference – and you must !! if you don’t take time to make a difference – don’t complain about the outcome.
November 30th, 2009 at 10:32 pm
Tom Hill. I think we can all agree that health care is costing to much. Our differences come not so much from shooting holes in proposals, but in the government taking over. It has to be obvious to any observer that the government creates more confusion and adds unrelated gadgets to mounds of unnecessary verbage to get what they need from the package. It is mainly a smoke screen designed to make us beleive that they are better at fixing the problem then we are all the while making a larger monster. In the end any government take over has always lead to more not fewer problems. This health care thing is no different. I am not singling out any party as much as I am big government no matter who is at the helm. That being said, conservatives have a lot of ideas that make sense, but they are being down played and largly ignored by the press. The present plans being offered have been drafted and edited by all democrats. Repubicians have been shut out, their ideas hushed and proposals cut down with no chance of seeing daylight. Such is the power of the present congress and senate. Hence you get aggravated right wingers. If the shoe was on the other foot the cry would be just as loud if not louder. I have no hard feelings for democrats they are part of my life, friends, family, co workers and fellow Americans. We just have differences of opinion. I beleive we all want the same end result, with differnt ideas on how to get there. So it is my contention that a government take over will not produce the results we all want. Like it or not all government entitlement programs are in serious financial straights. Making another gigantic program is not going to cure anything only break the backs of taxpayers. If you think health care is expensive now just watch what happens if this thing passes. There has to be a better way.